Lord Dhimmi of Foscote

As mentioned in last night’s news feed, a British peer named Lord Scott suggested yesterday that more people should marry Muslims as a way of improving “relationships between faith groups”. During his brief speech in the House of Lords, Lord Scott mentioned as supporting evidence the fact that two of his children, one male and one female, had converted to Islam and married Muslims.

One can but wonder: did Lord Scott, as a result of the famous cluelessness so common among British aristocrats, accidentally let the cat out of the bag? Is the conversion of members of the landed gentry in Britain a growing trend? Is the British aristocracy in fact becoming Islamic in anticipation of what lies ahead?

It would be a prudent move on their part — they would remain the ruling class, acting as emirs under the new Caliph. Those who act now will get to keep their country estates and privileges — and even acquire new ones! And no respected Islamic peer has to give up any of his little, ahem, customary pastimes, provided he continue to be discreet about them.

How many, including Prince Charles, are low-key converts? No formal announcement is needed: one simply says the shahada in front of a trusted imam who understands the utility of recruiting high-ranking converts whilst keeping the proceedings quiet. And, at the same time, keep knighting more Muslims such as Baroness Warsi, adding them to the peerage.

Our British correspondent JP has prepared a little treatise about Lord Scott, accompanied by the official parliamentary record of yesterday’s exchanges between the noble lords and ladies in the House of Lords.

Update: The video of Lord Scott’s statement is here, from about 14:15 to 15:06 in the clip. The seven little Muslims are mentioned at 14.26. The Hansard text is included from 08.35 to 15.21.

Baron Dhimmi of Foscote
by JP

Richard Rashleigh Folliott Scott, Baron Scott of Foscote, not to be confused with either Lord Scott Disick, Lord of Our Manor of Cruckton Ford and US reality television star of Keeping up with the Kardashians or potential suitors of Lady Gaga hoping to become Lord Gaga, caused a minor stir yesterday when he extolled the virtues of marrying Muslims as a means of combating Islamophobia.

It is possible that the noble and right reverend Lord is onto something and here are five other suggestions for the government to consider in its unstinting efforts to nudge Christians and others into contented acceptance of Islam.

1.   Her Majesty’s Customs and Revenue to introduce top up options for those wishing to make Voluntary Contributions to legitimate Muslim charities such as Islamic Relief and Muslim Aid.
2.   Special dispensations for landlords and letting agencies to use “Muslims only need apply” adverts.
3.   Restriction of sales of pork to special Pork shops in designated kafir zones. Customers would need to show a special Entitled Pork Purchaser Licence (EPPL) to be issued by a freshly-minted Department of Kafir Business.
4.   Ensure that planning authorities take account of mosque proximity when granting permission for new alcohol-dispensing premises, dog grooming parlours or anything else that might offend.
5.   Muslim only pedestrian zones in major cities. Better perhaps that car ownership is restricted to Muslims and all others travel either by foot, public transport or donkey.

The debate as recorded by Hansard, including ever so slightly gaga remarks by Lord Scott:

8 July 2014: Columns 112-114

Faith Group Relationships

Question 2.45 pm

Asked by Lord Carrington of Fulham

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what measures they plan to take to improve the relationship between the Muslim community and other faith groups in the United Kingdom.

The Senior Minister of State, Department for Communities and Local Government & Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Baroness Warsi) (Con): My Lords, the Department for Communities and Local Government published its strategy Creating the Conditions for Integration in 2012. This sets out the work of the Government and other organisations in helping to create the right conditions for everybody in society to participate. The Government are supporting projects to break down barriers, encourage community cohesion and celebrate what we have in common.

Lord Carrington of Fulham (Con): My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that Answer. With some young British Muslims being radicalised, does she agree that it is very important that they are taught at a very young age, either in school or elsewhere, to understand the similarities between all religions, in particular the shared values of the Abrahamic religions, so they can understand that Christianity and Judaism are not the enemies of Islam? Can she suggest the best way to make this come about?

Baroness Warsi: My Lords, it is important that all people, especially young people, have an understanding of the diverse communities in which we live, including different faith communities. My noble friend may be heartened to know from surveys, including a DCLG survey from a few years ago, that 90% of Muslims agreed that people from different backgrounds get on well, as opposed to 87% of the general population; 89% of Muslims agreed that it is possible to fully belong to Britain and maintain a religious identity, compared to 72% of the general population; and 74% of Muslims believe that there should be more mixing between different communities and different ethnic and religious groups, compared to 71% of the general public.

Lord Patel of Bradford (Lab): My Lords, will the Minister say what plans the Government have to work with the media to encourage them to stop publishing demonising articles about whole communities because of the actions of a handful of terrorists?

Baroness Warsi: As an ex-chairman of the Conservative Party, I wish I could get the media to stop publishing demonising articles. The noble Lord raises an incredibly important point. One of the strands of the work of the cross-government group on anti-Muslim hatred is looking at how we can work with the Society of Editors, among others, to ensure that headlines are, first and foremost, not sensational, but secondly, reflective of facts.

Lord Harries of Pentregarth (CB): Does the Minister agree that in many parts of the country, relations between Muslims and other faith communities are extremely good? This was true in the diocese of Oxford when I was there and continues to be so. Because of the good relationships between faith leaders, including Muslim leaders, it has been possible to dissipate many potential signs of trouble.

Baroness Warsi: The noble and right reverend Lord makes an incredibly important point. I am incredibly proud of the work that the Government have done in harnessing the power of faith groups to create that understanding. One flagship has been the Near Neighbours programme. The Government have invested £8.5 million since the start of this Government in the Church of England’s Church Urban Fund, using the network of the Church of England to create better understanding between different faith communities.

Lord Hussain (LD): My Lords, will the Minister tell the House if she thinks that the Government’s approach in dealing with the so-called Trojan horse issue is a help or a hindrance in the fight to tackle extremism in this country?

Baroness Warsi: My Lords, my noble friend makes an important point; everything that we do in tackling extremism must be done in a way that actually resolves extremism. Our language, our policy approach and our conduct must satisfy the end goal rather than the process.

Baroness Uddin (Non-Afl): My Lords, would the Minister take the opportunity to pay condolences to the family of the student Nahid al-Manea, who was brutally murdered on the streets of England? Does she accept that some of these very brutal attacks and the rise of Islamophobia are real reasons why some young people are resistant to working across different faith groups? I agree that an enormous amount of work has been done in this country. Would the Minister accept that England’s record in the arena of multifaith work is second to none?

Baroness Warsi: My Lords, the issue of anti-Muslim hatred and Islamophobia is something that I have personally championed. One of the first speeches that I gave in government was about Islamophobia. I used the phrase, “Islamophobia has passed the dinner-table test”—and probably still bear the scars of it. It is important that we fight this new form of hate crime and that the Government have, rightly, invested in projects such as Tell MAMA, to record and make sure the data on anti-Muslim hate crime are accurate and credible.

It is important to make another point; we have been here before. There have been moments in our history when we have not been entirely comfortable with a faith community and we have questioned the loyalty of faith communities, whether that was the Jewish or the Catholic community. But our trust in our institutions and values has got us through it—and we will get through it again.

Lord Scott of Foscote (CB): My Lords, I have an interest on this Question because one of my two sons has become a Muslim and one of my two daughters has become a Muslim. I have 12 lovely grandchildren, seven of whom are little Muslims—or not that little now, because one of them is 21. And, of course, I have a Muslim son-in-law and a Muslim daughter-in-law. Family relationships since those events took place have been as happily familial, as close and as good as any parent or grandparent could wish. If an improvement is needed in relationships between faith groups, one way of promoting that might be to encourage interfaith marriages.

Baroness Warsi: First and foremost, my Lords, it is important that we allow people to marry somebody of their choosing, whatever faith they belong to. That is why I am incredibly proud that the Government have done so much work on the issue of forced marriages, including criminalising a practice that should have been criminalised many years ago.

34 thoughts on “Lord Dhimmi of Foscote


    As somebody from post-communist Eastern Europe, I grew up admiring the British for their courage during the last War, for their hero prime minister Churchill, for BBC, once a beacon of freedom in my and other countries … Munich, the shame, I viewed as historical deviation.

    Reading this, my friends, I am just worrying if Churchill, Montgomery, baroness Theatcher, etc., had not been the historical deviations, whereas Munich had been the regular pattertn.

    And I am seriously reconsidering the positive affections I had been feeling towards Britain, and the West in general. Do I want be a part of this degenerate civilisation? Hell no! Am I alone in my country having such feelings? No, I am not.

    Good Bye, Britain.

    • The best ideas from the West can propagate and spread to other parts of the world, as some of them are in Eastern Europe today.

      There is an international movement, of which this blog is part, to rebuild and reinvigorate the West, and to help its best traditions grow roots elsewhere.

      Socialism in its various guises, and now Islam, clearly caught the West off guard, starting over 100 years ago.

      The history of the past century has largely been one of socialists worming their way into Western institutions for the purpose of undermining them, and undermining belief in Western ideals. They paved a road on which the Mohammedans are now following.

      But notice that, especially in the English-speaking world, and most especially in the United States, the malefactors always keep their ultimate goals and their methods secret. They subvert society from the shadows, never placing their full scheme on the ballot. Indeed, they take care to keep it hidden, and to ignore, ridicule, or demonize anyone who attempts to expose it or them.

      Victory is never guaranteed, and at the present moment the near future seems dark. But the forces of good are better organized now, and are starting to gain some traction with the public. The socialists are starting to let their masks slip, and their Mohammedan allies are growing visibly rabid, as even the most dhimmwitted of journalists can hardly cover up any longer.

      Now is not the time to lose confidence in the eventual restoration of Western values. If we speak out for them boldly, we can convince the non-Islamic world to follow us. And if we do not, there is no other game in town.

      • The values pased by the West are no longer valid in the West itself. In the Eastern Europe we are free now and compared to the West and whole world the Czech Republic is a beacon of freedom.
        There will be a shift of our (Eastern European) perception of the (historically more western 🙂 West. From admiration and inspiration to disgust and pity (Stage represented by Martin Konvicka´s post). Then we will adapt to the new geopolitical situation and shift to the third stage, we will take responsibility for the western values and will help to force them down to dhimmitized throats screaming Islam

  2. What “interfaith marriages”? What´s “interfaith” on a muslim marrying a muslim? Now most of his lineage will be muslim – forever. What an idiot…

    • And if anyone insists on the term “interfaith”, then they should know that ALL children born in these marriages will be muslims – simple as that. The more “interfaith” marriages, the more little muslims. Fair to say islam is ingenius in that.

      • How deluded can one get! Poor Lord Scott…I also used to admire Britain especially under Mrs Thatcher, not any longer…I fear for Britain. Their tolerance of intolerance is just shocking and they don’t even realize. That’s how brainwashed by their PC and diversity and god knows what they have become…

  3. When I read the questions and answer of the Lords and Ladies, I wonder in what world are those fine people living? Or are all the tips I am reading about Great Britain wrong cq. unrepresentative? Obviously the class society in Great Britain is still kicking and alive. What a wonderful world they live in, by closing their eyes for all the ugly things which happen around them.

    • “the …. political leadership of the West inhabits plastic bubbles full of happy gas.”
      pongidae rex, comment, at Jihadwatch

    • It is hard to say, if those persons are only stupid, or the traitors of our civilisation “

      • They are selfish: I and me. Has anyone taught them since they were 2 years, to love their neighbors, to love their country. I have lived in England: they are aloof, never take to strangers, never talk to strangers unless they talk to them first. You live their for years and never really try to break the ice or befriend you. They don’t care what happened to their neighbors. They don’t interfere and mind their own business unless they are yobs and make your life hell. Yobs are never punished, so people keep to themselves to have that wall between them in order to avoid conflicts. They were usually very arrogant and conceited thus never able to understand others, even their own or have empathy. All the above and other attitudes and state and newspaper propaganda led to the horrible situation Britain is in now. When some Pakistanis were imported they did not react. When intermarriages began in the sixties, they did not interfere, when mosques and other temples went up, and churches were demolished, they were happy because Christianity was judgmental, and they wanted to be free. No restrains. That was followed with no restraints on borders. Free countries should have no borders unlike the communist countries whose borders were secure. Small steps were takes and the number of invaders increased with increased propaganda to swallow the bait, ( invaders create jobs, enrich our culture, . . .) When a few people woke up they were sent to British gulags, fired, squashed like flies, derided: treated like the victims of the communist regime and even worse. Today the only freedom left in Britain is to revile Christianity and the great freedom of extolling and exalting and beatifying the ugliness of Islam.

  4. I guess the questions and answers (and no, I did not read them all just the first four as the treachery became more obvious) speak as to the mindset of the aristocracy that has got Britain to where it is now – at a cultural crossroad.

    But this mindset goes back a long time, in fact, back to at least the middle of the Nineteenth Century when the aristocracy became enamoured of all things Arab.

    Lawrence of Arabia was a product of that kind of thinking which extended into the era of between the wars and the rise of Nazi Germany, which was looked upon as having much in common with Islam by the then treasonous British Aristocracy who undoubtedly, IMO, became secretly and heavily involved in the ‘peace process’ with Nazi Germany that ended with the failure of Rudolph Hess’ inability to land at a prominent Lord’s private airfield in Scotland, in May 1941, due to having to bail out of his out of fuel Me bf 110 aircraft, and parachuting into captivity in which the ‘peace plot’ was uncovered and hushed up due to the very prominent members – some even pointing fingers at monarchy – of the Aristocracy involved in the plot to overthrow Churchill and the democratically elected government to form an alliance with Hitler.

    That kind of thinking does not die out if not ruthlessly eradicated by those in power at the time!

    Hence we are now seeing the fruit that has been able to grow because those who should have exposed the Aristocracy for what they were and are still to this day – Traitors – failed in their duty, for reasons best known to themselves, to do so.

    It is now up to the people to make their displeasure felt to those who would enslave them to Allah!

  5. Not dhimmitude but the wilful conversion by the British establishment utilising islam as a form of socio-political control, also the British peoples have fallen into the passive acceptance of islam as social currency in their misguided desire for good society – when all else fails convert to islam.

    Difficult to gauge how far down the islamic path the British conscience is but culturally and politically it is much further from Christianity than it is from islam.

  6. The lord did not reflect over the fact that both his children had to abandon their original religion. It happens very seldom that a muslim leaves islam. So much for “interfaith”.
    The rules are setup for muslim supremacy. There is no balanced situation.

    • Not necessarily. If you are a “Christer” then you have surely grasped that we can never take anything for granted. And if you study history, you know how, in the long run, despite victory after victory, Islam was vanquished. Please do not make predictions about Muslim supremacy based on the day’s headlines. We live in a truly chaotic system – chaotic in the way science looks at chaos, and the way that historians of any worth look at the future – i.e., there are simply too many unknowns to predict anything with surety.

      From your remarks – and those of others – it sounds as though you have been infected with the socialists’ gloom-and-doom virus. The same one that told us in 1970 that we’d be out of fossil fuels by the end of the century. The same one that said there’d be massive starvation and predicted an ice age. This last has varied with each change in the winds of opinion to global warming to climate change to human-caused weather disasters. And with each new pronouncement from these naked emperors, the crowds stop watching The World Cup long enough to cry “we’re all doooomed”.

      The incessant Chinese water torture of bad news about the future of the world, or of a given country is a shell game played by hucksters for their own enrichment and to the loss of the average person.

      How about a new game for a change? We’ll tell you the MSM daily tale of woe, and y’all tell us the Good News…Counter what the chattering classes and experts say with evidence that it ain’t so.

  7. I am far from a man infested by Socialist “Doom virus”. I do hope the British will
    wake up and finally and stop this nonsense and finally reject this “faith”. I hope that the traditional commonsense of the “Working Class” finally reasserts itself. It usually does but dear Lord it seems to take so much, before it happens.

    The biggest curse is the Idioticy of “Chattering Metroburbs” that inhabit the Seventh Heaven of New Age Multiculturalism of a quantum singularity called The Guardian and the like. These people are clueless and cowards and are the real problem.

    While they deny that terrorism has “anything to do with Islam”, the average mucker in the street knows differently. They have not forgotten Lee Rigby. Nor have I but by today’s standards I am not considered “normal” since I actually believe in a militant Christ prepared to defend Christendom. Fifty years ago I was “legit”.

    I think Britain will go Islamic for a while simply due to the thicks and cultural naysayers above. However, the average “bloke” down the Greasy Spoon cafe, has little time for the Metroburbs and is voting UKIP. The latter will now place a permanent brake on the intentions of the Metroburbs and their “Betters” in the dhimmi “Ermined Mob”-many of whom are Blair “plants”.

    Yes Islam holds sway for now and in truth Britain is already “Islamic” but one more atrocity like Lee Rigby, plus what is coming out of Iraq and I think the so far bovine cow that permeates the ether, will finally say enough. It happened in the 1930s and will happen again. The Police will have their hands full and no amount of body armour, or PC Diversity “Pleecing” will save them, nor the water cannons brought in by “Haystack Boris”- another Islamophile buffoon.

    • The rot is deep. One more Lee Rigby won’t make a tipping point in a country where only the criminals and the police have guns and neither group has any respect for “the average mucker in the street” who tries to be law-abiding and prides himself on his own “tolerance”.

      Tolerance by itself isn’t a virtue, it’s a mindless, fearful “heads-below-the-parapet”.

      That is not to say there isn’t a tipping point but I think it’s going to be sudden and unpredictable and likely to coincide with the bankruptcy of the welfare state. As in what happens when the dole money doesn’t come. What have the dole-less left to lose? You can be sure the Chancellor of the Exchequer has HIS bolthole all arranged.

      When things change, it will be a period where people will look back and say, “oh, right. I should have seen it coming.” But that is the nature of the unforeseen: it can’t be known ahead of time. In retrospect it seems heavily inevitable.

  8. Then again I make it my business to see what is happening at “ground level”. Sure you are right in that once the welfare stops, may will resort to violence. However, “Dymphna” (nice name), I live daily among these “Working Class” folk and they are far from broken believe me.

    Do not swallow the garbage coming out of the Presstitute Media. Not all poor Britons are “chavs” and tattooed morons on the make with pea-sized brains and Crow accents. The “working class is still very much alive despite being “ignored” for not doing its “Socialist duty” in the 1970s etc. Zanu Labour made a great mistake when it chose to ignore its traditional voters.

    There is a massive groundswell of deep, deep resentment around and within this tier of “Society” and that is spreading to the “Middle-Class” too as the economy fails. The “Rulership” and the “Metroburbs” live in Fantasy Land. Memories of the Miner’s Strike still haunt the North.

    It will one day “Blow”- I guarantee it, especially if immigration but in particular Islmisation doesn’t slow. I have not written off the British “Working Class” yet and we outnumber the Metroburbs and Elite in the millions.

    UKIP is just the start and the shock over paedophile scandals but also deep dislike in the way we are ignored over matters moral, like pansy “marriage” runs deep. Most of us are still loyal to our normal old fashioned traits and dislike sodomy and are prepared to say so too.

    Even I have a “Pleece” Caution after being arrested for refusal to conduct a Sodomite “wedding”- an act that is actually forbidden for the Church to do in England but, it did not stop my local Police from verbally abusing me in front of my family in our home. The “copper” was gay himself it later transpired. There is a big difference from Policing to “Diversity Pleecing”…

    This resentment is building and it will burst…Mark my words.

      • It can´t have a peaceable end, can it? What options does Britain have? These British “ISIS fighters” and people like them, they used to be kids brainwashed with islam. They didn´t “become” radical, they were raised radical – it´s their parents that did it to them. Just check their respective stories, “strict” parents, going to muslim seminars etc. – and for a muslim parent raising a muslim child is a prime goal in life. You have no means to stop them doing that. And you can´t kick them out, can you? They all are British citizens. Look at what GB does – payy benefits to scum like Choudary! I see it bleakly – there will be war. The only question is who will fight who.

    • Bishop, I’m not sure about the relative numbers of “working” and “middle” class you imply, though it depends on your definitions.

      The Labour Party shifted to the centre and rebranded itself because its core, working class vote was in decline.

      • Mark- A question:

        Was the working class vote in decline because the actual numbers of people who would be termed “working class” (based I presume on their jobs rather than their income?) had declined in numbers as people moved up to middle class or down to…what would you call those people who are thought of as lower than working class? Would those be folks on the dole?

        Do you know where to find figures for the percentages of people in each class? How does the average Brit define middle class? In the US the parameters are mostly defined by income, but not entirely. And some of it is self-selection or designation, of course.

        Theodore Dalrymple writes scathingly (and scarily) about Britain’s underclass. I don’t think anyone here has come out with a whole book on the subject, but it would be harder here since the welfare state of mind is less entrenched. The idea of a person going through life without ever holding a job is a hard concept to get one’s mind around. Mark Steyn writes tellingly of his experience of the lay-abouts he encountered in London.

        Many of those who might be the lay-abouts Steyn saw in London have been over here penned up in our over-crowded prisons. John Kennedy closed our mental hospitals; after that our prison population exploded.

        • Just been watching a programme on the world service. According to this, the US prison system is now a substitute. albeit a poor one, for mental hospitals in the US.

          As a former Principal Local Government officer, I am not sure whether that would make me working or middle class. I had been a member of the Labour Party, the REAL Labour Party, until they started forcing Cultural Marxism down our throats in the mid 80’s and I left in disgust.

          I meet party members now who spout PC/MC propaganda in incessant volume and I wonder where all the workers went. I meet a lot of them here in Thailand. They, too, have given up in disgust.

        • Sorry for the delay replying, Dymphna. Can’t quote figures, but I think it’s fair to say that in the UK, “class” was traditionally an attribute of occupation and aspiration. Although I never earned much while working, both my occupation, retail, and especially my interests, such as classical music, would tend to define me as middle class, although skilled “workers” were often paid much more (some with strong unions, such as London Tube drivers, still are).

          Up to about the 1980s, people in manual jobs, especially those requiring some skills, improved their lot, particularly if they had strong unions, and had less incentive to vote for the Labour Party traditionally associated with their occupations and their unions.

          It’s more complicated now. Much as I detested PM Thatcher for her methods and apparent lack of empathy, she arrested, or at least slowed, Britain’s decline (which began in the late C19th*). This recovery was of course partly based on “freeing” the financial sector, and we all know where that led. Even after the 2008 crash, around 75% of the population are better off than 25 years ago, and the votes of the remainder, or those expressing genuine solidarity, would not have brought Labour to power in 1997 unless it had reinvented itself as less anti-business and more pro-aspiration. The other 25%, if in work, often struggle on low wages- bear in mind that the UK government pays more benefits to those in work than the unemployed.

          Like Peter below, I heard the BBC programme on the mentally ill in US prisons, and their treatment. Not scoring points, but it makes our lack of support for them sound positively benign.

          *Not the first time we’ve been here, Dymphna, but as I understand it, Britain’s economic decline began in the late Nineteenth Century, when the more recently industrialised nations, Germany and the US, invested heavily in the new processes of chemical and electrical engineering and we failed to. Exploitation of the Empire/Commonwealth delayed the consequences till after WW2.

  9. I wish to take exception. Yes, I know about the jolly good old chaps with titles, have read enough PG Wodehouse and what not. However, the lever that operates this nincompoop is not his peerage but hie legal education and judgeship. There is something about law education in the entire West and the way it’s reflected in jurisprudence and politics (after all, the majority of Western pols have legal education) that combines arrogance with stupidity no less than it did among inbred, wastrel drunkard baronets 300 years ago.

    However, just to give his Lordship his due, I suggest he marry the Baroness Warsi , with Baroness Uddin as the maid of honor and Lords Hussain and Patel as best men. How sad that the levers of power in Great Britain are held firmly by the autochthon insane or the foreign all-too-sane and self serving. The people can do little about it, having ceded their once-inviolable rights, power, sovereignty and common sense little by little over 60+ years now.

  10. Lord Carrington of Fulham? I must have missed that one. As plain Matthew Carrington this joker was elected MP for Fulham in the mid 1980s and he doesn’t appear to have changed. At the time, I was dealing with service level complaints for the local council and during the first three weeks after Carrington’s election, he must have sent me more letters than I received from my entire family during my lifetime up till then. In the end, it took a quiet word with the leader of the Conservative Group (also a Fulham man) who managed to explain to Matthew Carrington what it was that an MP should be doing and my postbox shrank accordingly. Once a buffoon always a buffoon.

  11. If I were told that the above dialogue was part of a comic operetta – perhaps by a latter day W.S.Gilbert I would not have doubted it. Words simply fail me.

  12. I really was speechless above. I have now found some words (and might find more). What can one say about My Lord Scott (it may not be obvious to Americans but these are not real Aristocracy – hereditary Peers – but appointed during their life, for life and no more – The real Peers have been sacked though not guillotined). How can he be concerned about relations between different faiths seeing that among his offspring their appears to be only one faith – Islam. What private shame must he endure seeing his offspring abandon the faith in which they were brought up (as I assume they must have been) – not for another Xtian denomination , or the doubts of Agnosticim or certainties of Atheism even as they continue as cultural Xtians but for the religion that has caused (surely) more trouble in the world than any other. Even in living memory in England he must have heard of Rushdie, The Danish Cartoons, 7/7 and Lee Rigby – if any other group behaved in that manner they would surely be banned – but no, they are treated with kid-gloves and as honoured guests. Coming myself from a mixed marriage (my father was a 1st generation life-time Roman Catholic and my mother wasn’t – all of her relatives refused to attend the wedding) I have lived with and continue to live with the dreadful consequences of mixed marriage – yet Catholics are so they aver Xtians and do not usually so far as I can see seek special privilege.

    It is worth remembering that Hobbes was of the view that the religion of the country (just one) should be decided by the Prince and although that is not quite what happened in England, by reason of the similarity between most Xtians (being Protestant) and in any event restricting adherence thereto to their day off – Sunday – religious trouble vanished; and that Locke, when approving of toleration did not even think that tolerance should extend so far as to Roman Catholics – Islam was not mentioned but his view would surely be certain.

    There is something surreal in reading the speeches of the Noble Lords and Ladies for the tone is nothing less than that one might expect at a Vicar’s Tea Party; the world is wonderful if only we will as we surely will be nice to each other – and we will throw lots of money at the problem. Why I ask rhetorically am I reminded of Marie Antoinette playing Shepherdess.

    • It was ever thus: town folk are so habituated to good manners that it would be a greater crime to break wind in public than recite the shahada in the upper chamber.

      Here is a quote from Henry Fielding’s The History of Tom Jones, a Foundling (about p. 290 depending on edition)

      “He then bespattered the youth with abundance of that language which passes between country gentleman who embrace opposite sides of the question; with frequent applications to him to salute that part which is generally introduced into all controversies that arise among the lower orders of the English gentry at horse-races, cock-matches, and other public places. Allusions to this part are likewise often made for the sake of jest. And here, I believe, the wit is generally misunderstood. In reality, it lies in desiring another to kiss you a– for having just before threatened to kick his; for I have observed very accurately, that no one ever desires you to kick that which belongs to himself, nor offers to kiss this part in another.

      It may likewise seem surprizing that in the many thousand kind invitations of this sort, which every one who hath conversed with country gentlemen must have heard, no one, I believe, hath ever seen a single instance where the desire hath been complied with; – a great instance of their want of politeness; for in town nothing can be more common than for the finest gentlemen to perform this ceremony every day to their superiors, without having that favour once requested of them.”

      • Of course despite the platitudes you know that things are not and cannot be well as between Islam and the various other religions and religious denominations throughout England – otherwise there would be no need to mention the fact or spend squillions of euros on achieving peace and harmony, and indeed before the recent arrival en-masse in England of Islam no one would have mentioned it either. Whenever did one hear local medical practitioners, accountants, lawyers or bankers, say that the relations as between their practice and their rival was uniformly good – as if that was a matter for relief? You never did because they merely pursue their own business unconcerned with their rival. Were you however to hear it one would be certain a takeover was in the offing.

        Having said that (and in the interests of fairness) my local mosque is entirely discreet and surely a considerable improvement on the pub which previously occupied the building from which I (on my only visit thereto) narrowly escaped with my life or sever beating; prior to its loss of licence – and not a moment too soon.

  13. I return to observe that earlier today The Baroness Warsi resigned her position as a Foreign Office Minister in protest at H.M. Governments policy in relation to Gaza. Ms Warsi is not I think an Arab neither Egyptian nor Palestinian but (from her look and name) I would guess form the Indian Sub-continent. Her appointment was facilitated by her being female, and dark-skinned (an thus not English) and Muslim. How priceless therefore that she reveals her true loyalty namely to Islam and not to Britain or its ‘vital interests’.

    Every action they say has an equal and opposite reaction and that includes appointing people on a politically correct basis. How amusing therefore to re-read her words above and see them for their hypocricy.

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